The culture that is San Francisco solve for the equilibrium

A man threw his body onto a self-driving car — a GM Cruise AV — causing a car vs. pedestrian collision at the 16th and Valencia intersection earlier this month, the DMV reported Wednesday.

Operating in “autonomous mode,” the Cruise AV was stopped at a green light, facing northbound on Valencia, waiting to make a right turn onto 16th Street as pedestrians crossed.

Suddenly, a man ran across Valencia Street against the “do not walk” sign, shouting, and struck the left side of the car’s rear bumper and hatch with his entire body. This is all according to a report the self-driving car manufacturer must file with the DMV in the event of a collision.

The man sustained no injuries, but the car did. It suffered “some damage to its right rear light,” according to the report.

Here is the full story.


Truly, a hero for our age.

Just like the Tank Man in Tiananmen Square back in 1989!

This is the result of the victory of the ACLU over mental health care. Now they must be allowed to live on the streets, harm people and do stupid things like this rather than get mental health care.

You wanna pay for all those mental hospitals housing the homeless? Doesn't seem like a GWTW kind of position.

Actually, assuming we could keep the costs reasonable, I'd much rather pay those costs. If we could do a quid pro quo, by decreasing the prison population on a 1 to 1 basis for every mental health care patient we institutionalized, is would probably be a break even.

I'm with YOU I just didn't think GWTW thought it THROUGH before he took his shot at the ACLU. When I dis, I rhyme.

Yes. It could easily be paid for by cutting services to illegal aliens and not sending the mentally ill to jail for relatively minor offenses.

"It could easily be paid for by cutting services to illegal aliens"

The bulk of services to illegal aliens can't be legally cut (emergency medical care, general services, etc) or to their children (K-12 education, healthcare etc).

Yes, I do. I'm paying much higher costs due to their not being in the hospital.

and the point of posting this little story here would be ... ?

Brought to you by the Provo, UT, business development council.

What equilibrium are we supposed to be solving for, when there was a single irrational action that had no apparent affect on anything?

Perhaps Tyler is envisioning self driving vehicle opponents trying to intentionally cause self driving car accidents to create fear?

Maybe the idea is self-driving cars will become targets for vandalism and/or theft. Beaten like a rented mule, as the saying goes?

Perhaps, but I don't find either idea plausible.

These cars are covered with cameras, making it kind of hard to target them for crimes.

A little barbecue sauce is all it takes...

Simple solution: if you throw barbecue sauce at such a device, you have to pay full replacement cost.

This won't work in Sandinista run San Fran, but there are places where the rule of law actually functions.

The short-term equilibrium is that jaywalking will increase, as people know for a fact these cars will stop for them, and can purposefully block traffic for yuks or whatever.

The long-term equilibrium is increased enforcement of jay walking laws.

I believe this is the correct answer.

+1, this does seem the most likely answer.

One can easily envision jumping in front of a self-driving car as the new idiotic "challenge" trend.

And this doesn't feel slightly dystopian to you? The homeless ex-driver is tracked by ubiquitous surveillance and facial recognition, as he takes a quick shortcut on a deserted street a citation issued.

Do you know what a strawman argument is? That's when you argue against a point that was never made.

For example, DW said: "The long-term equilibrium is increased enforcement of jay walking laws."

And then you jumped to: "The homeless ex-driver is tracked by ubiquitous surveillance and facial recognition, as he takes a quick shortcut on a deserted street a citation issued."

You'll note that no where in his comment did he mention or propose the words "ubiquitous surveillance", "facial recognition", or issuing citations for walking across a deserted street.

I'm not trying to be snarky here, instead I'm trying to help. No one will take you seriously when you repeatedly try to cast other peoples motives and comments in the worst possible light.

All I did was give you a science fiction very short story. That's what science fiction is for, to paint projections of current culture and new technologies.

Self driving cars and ubiquitous surveillance with facial recognition are real things, in our present, and trending toward greater use.

Meanwhile, what are we going to do with those ex-drivers?

"All I did was give you a science fiction very short story."

Translation: I strawmanned the hell out of a post, but I'm not willing to admit it.

"Meanwhile, what are we going to do with those ex-drivers?"

Translation: Now I'd like to move the goal posts to a completely different point....

JWatts, if you'd like to write a more optimistic sci-fi on the arrival of the self-driving car and truck, go ahead. I won't complain.

JWatts, I think you are being a bit harsh here.

I took Anonymous as making their own prediction about the likely future outcome, rather than implying anyone else said that. While I don't agree, I don't think it's a straw man argument.

"JWatts, I think you are being a bit harsh here."

Ok, that's fair. My apologies Anonymous for being a jerk here.

+1 correct.

Also sounds like welfare maximizing.

If I were to make a bet right now, I would say self-driving will be bad for blue collar workers. The technology is trending forward, but sentiment toward transfers, retraining, etc. is trending backward. You have to imagine a very different world where you have both self-driving everything and pensions for ex-drivers.

That said, I doubt the Red State working class will pick up on it until they get their pink slips, so do the R&D in Red States, especially one as well-behaved as Utah.

You mean truck drivers won't do well in a world of autonomous? Real hot take there, guy.

The "threat" of job replacement goes way back, but has there ever been one technology that would impact so many jobs in such a short time?

Assuming self-driving goes from not ready, to ready, in a few years?

Cars went from a novelty to tens of millions produced in less than 20 years. That had a huge effect on many employment sectors.

Here is my summary position:

1) I don't think better-than-human driving will be possible very soon.

2) I am worried that concern for drivers is limited to that "market provides" wing and a prayer. It doesn't, in Appalachia etc.

3) In the best of all possible worlds, such hugely transformative technologies would be paired with benefits for the displaced.

4) In the worst possible world, we' d be distracting these drivers with lines like "don't worry, we'll build a wall, so those Mexicans can't take your job."

Self driving trucks would be great for Trump voters. Customers would be required to hire low wage workers to stand in front of their homes all day from 8am to 8pm to grab packages from robot cars to prevent the robot dumping the packages in the street 30 seconds after the hatch opens, one minute after the alert on the customer cell phone to be at the road in one minute to take the package, or else it will be dumped on the road.

I did get packages delivered in December where the UPS truck had two workers, one driving, and the other finding packages while moving so he could take off running to porches at the next stop.

Socialist Europe has privatized by policy the mails, with only Germany fully implementing it, with Deutsche Post DHL Group, which has provided free central mail boxes and storage lockers to eliminate the need to deliver packages to customers, outsourcing the last mile to customers who work for free.

The US Post Office outsourced delivery boxes to customers, dictating their form, and where the customer must place them. I never understood why conservatives never called on UPS and FedEx to dictate specific package delivery boxes be bought by customers and installed in order to get packages, instead of complaining about them not being able to deliver packages in the too small USPS dictated boxes.

Conservatives advocate free lunch economic policies that fail to look at the entire value chain from worker to worker. Ie, workers pay for stuff with the money from workers serving workers both providing them stuff and paying for the stuff workers get paid to produce. Driving trucks and passenger vehicles is only a minute part of the value chain. I traveled yesterday in a car and bus that had a driver driving very slowly in extremely heavy traffic in great driving weather, so the traffic reflects the decade plus of failing to pay Trump voters to build infrastructure. Trump reflects the free lunch economic theory of development by advocating trillions in infrastructure construction without paying anything to workers. After all, he delivered on the free lunch economic mandate to cut prices by killing jobs in order to grow the economy and create jobs. Thus the $1.5 trillion in tax cuts to spur an increased trillion in new infrastructure investment, ie, selling highways to toll companies which the hike the price of using it while killing jobs to generate high profits on assets now priced several times the price paid to privatize them.

Mulp, where is Socialist Europe located?

Everyone knows conservatives and the GOP are the best for business and profits so all the best innovation comes from Red States.

It's just the liberal media pushes fake news on how all the great innovation comes from the liberal hellholes where the coastal liberal elites control everything.

Smartphones were really invented in Alabama. Uber was really invented in Mississippi. Autonomous vehicles were invented in West Virginia. Internet shopping and two day free delivery was invented in Indiana.

Autonomous vehicles were invented in West Virginia.

Then they exercised their autonomy and drove away from WV

We had a similar revolution in the late 19th century. Almon Strowger invented the automatic telephone exchange for the explicit purpose of eliminating operators. Strowger was a funeral director, one of two in the town where he lived. He suspected a telephone operator was directing business to his competitor, so he invented the dial telephone and the Strowger switch (used to decode the dial pulses at the central office). Just to get rid of that one operator, he got rid of most operators everywhere. He ultimately sold his company to AT&T for a remarkably low price and went back to being a funeral director.

That's hilarious. Thanks!

I heard that something close to half of man are employed in driving of one kind or another. Depending on the pace of change, this could be a big disruption.

Thank you.

Truly the Bultarian Jihad has begun.

Butlerian* :))

Related thread, coding bootcamps in Appalachia.

Spam, methinks.

You really can't see the connection? This obviously is about the difficulty of replacing many low skilled jobs with fewer hi-tech ones.

y'all {


Stupid browser

y'all {
if'n ye have your druthers,
poop or get off the pot
} skedaddle

I could do a better job with this if I had time.

I feel like I should tell a story here. The first time I worked in the south on an engineering job my contact had "no" accent, like me. In limped a guy (I'm not kidding) who started talking with a heavy backwoods accent. I noticed immediately that everyone in the room was deferring to him, and he was the guy to really talk to.

So you know, y'all {..} might be in fun, but some really smart dudes (in a non-gender sense) will present with a y'all. And that is certainly confirmed by the high success (tech perspective) on that retraining.

Just a random act by a deranged individual, nothing more. That intersection is near a major BART station. The plaza is for all practical purposes a permanent homeless encampment with many suffering from mental health issues. The SF welfare-industrial complex likes it just that way.

Are they providing free tickets for homeless people that want to move elsewhere?

Yes homeward bound program

The culture that is San Francisco is that lunatics roam the street, some of them pooping right in the middle of the sidewalk, and everyone acts like nothing's wrong.

Hey it's biodegradable and ........ORGANIC!

This is not necessarily an AV thing. Long ago back in Skokie a guy basically did that to us as we were slowly driving through downtown. Except he chose the front of the car.

The local police already knew of him, and there was no injury or damage.

It was very exciting though!

Kinda like we blamed taxis for not servicing the hood. In the future, when algorithmic walls are fully maximized around certain communities, we will discuss how incentives led to automated deserts. In the long run, automated tanks will keep the hamsterdams at bay.

Related, the new nice private passenger train down in Florida keeps hitting idiots who walk on the tracks and evade the safety barriers.

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