Coronavirus markets in everything

Government officials across Hubei province, the epicenter of the coronavirus outbreak, are desperate to find ways to stop the spread of the infection.

In Hubei’s Fangxian County, officials are trying a different approach — paying sick people.

According to an official Fangxian County notice, anyone who is sick and reports themselves to a hospital can expect to be paid.

Patients who have a fever and turn themselves in will receive 1,000 yuan ($142).

But officials and other interested parties are also being offered cash incentives if they catch anyone with a fever. For each person with a fever who is reported by an official or citizen, there is a reward of 500 yuan ($71).

The notice said that the offer is only valid from today until February 18.

Here is the link (nothing extra there, except a noisy video and you have to scroll down a lot).  Via Neville.

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Is there any way to raise your body temperature temporarily without actually being sick? I'm asking for a friend.

Of course. The easiest is simply do some physical exercise. A sauna will definitely work too, though one assumes that is uncommon in China.

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2,4-Dinitrophenol is a simple molecule that shorts out the proton gradient that mitochondria use to make ATP for cellular energy. Use a little and your body compensates by ramping up metabolism, giving you a fever and leading to weight loss. Use a little more and you die.

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The standard research technique is injection of lipopolysaccharide. You can buy it easily from a lot of lab suppliers.

Prostaglandin E2 is the final inducer of pyrogenesis; we use it for a variety of OB indications and you can buy the drug for not that much.

The common factitious method patients use is to inject contaminated material into the blood stream. Basically anything with bacteria will work if you inject enough of it. Common ones I have seen include feces, bacterial culture, and cutaneous wound material.

Any of these will produce true fevers and can be done for something under $50. LPS is least likely to kill you.

If you want a really nasty "fever" on the cheap you can always dose yourself with 2,4 Dinitrophenol which would be a bear to dose (highly toxic, low therapeutic window), but remarkedly cheap per dose. However, going just a tiny bit high on your dosing will likely be fatal; accidental exposures have hit 109.

Frankly I doubt all that many people will take up the offer. Most likely getting on that list would come with significant risks of its own. I would be more worried about people with actual fevers thinking that we want to do something nefarious and we are paying money to so they should, run, run away.

When Sure gets one in his wheelhouse he usually knocks 'em out. +5 i.p.

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+1, awesome response

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Of course, those who volunteer to be quarantined (and stored in a lock-down warehouse) for $142 might regret the bargain. Then there are those who accept $71 to rat out a neighbor. Why the 50% lower price? Is it because even in China ratting out a friend is considered the devil's work? Fortunately, here in the U.S. we haven't yet had to deal with the economics of the coronavirus, but we have dealt with the economics of selling one's soul. And guess what? The price for a soul came cheap, real cheap.

+1

Good post!

I often wonder about the morals or values of the people of the PRC.

From where do they derive their values? The state? Confucianism? And what are those values?

Mine, good or bad, are derived from Irish Catholicism - love thy neighbor; do unto others; don't kill, steal, cheat, lie, or envy. Suppose none of those have any meaning in the PRC. Would I marry a Chinese woman? No, I wouldn't. That is actually an issue for me on Tinder. I swipe left on the Chinese citizens (not Chinese Americans). We know from behavioural economics (Ariely) that everyone cheats or lies a little bit, but not big lies. China has laws but not the rule of law. I think the power of the law to influence behavior exists in the minds of the people. The law is just a manifestation of the values of the people that created them. No values no law no rules and anything goes. That said, I am sure those values exist, but what are those values? When the values are non-existent or unknown there is no trust which has many unwelcome side effects.

I find that more than a little troubling.

How can you draw generalizations like that all the people from an entire country, particularly one with over a billion people? There are good Chinese people and bad Chinese people, same as any other ethnicity.

Please point out the generalization - I made none.

You said: “ Suppose none of those have any meaning in the PRC. Would I marry a Chinese woman? No, I wouldn't. That is actually an issue for me on Tinder. I swipe left on the Chinese citizens (not Chinese Americans).” Isn’t the implication there that no Chinese citizen women have moral values?

No.

I said "suppose none of those have any meaning", with "those" being the values I have internalized. The potential for mismatched expectations and misunderstandings is large. I am sure they have values, but they may not be the same. We derive our values from our parents and the surrounding culture. There is tremendous variation between cultures, and there is also variation in adherence to cultural norms within cultures. A deviant (varies from the norm) in one culture might be a hero in another.

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"Irish Catholicism - love thy neighbor; do unto others; don't kill, steal, cheat, lie, or envy." My how I laughed. I have too many Roman Catholics in my family to believe that short of rubbish.

EdR seems right, on average. Maybe it's your family dearieme.

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Those are the ideals of the dogma. I doubt many adhere to them perfectly. When we stray, we can compare our behaviour to the ideals and see the variance. Others can also call attention to deviant behaviour. The point is we have some, and in our case many, standards to measure ourselves against.

I am asking, "what are the Chinese values?"

What are they? Do you know?

"Others can also call attention to deviant behaviour."
Now, we know why Jews were persecuted. They forgot to call attention to their persecutors' deviancy from Beatitudes".

What are they? Do you know?"
Ask Xi. Do you think he would like to be seen openly stealing? No. As much as a Catholic would rather no do it or do it covertly. Just like Trump and his constant stiffing of customers, suppliers, Uncle Sam, etc. I guess not stealing is a value. Do you think he would want to be caughing ceating his wife? No, even if such a thing did not hurt Trump, Gingrich or Netanyahu's appeal for Evangelicals. There is no Fox News in China. Do you think Xi would like to be perceived as persecuting the innocent? No, obviously he is just liberating Tibet (wheter Tibetans want it or not) from Feudalism and superstition just like we are liberating Iraq and Afghanistan whether Iraqis and Afghans like it or not. So as you can see, the Chinese have their values just like we, Westerners, have and they can be as hypocritical about it as we can because, imagine that, they are human beings, too, just like Westerners.

"Chinese have their values just like we, Westerners, have and they can be as hypocritical about it as we can because, imagine that, they are human beings, too, just like Westerners."

Agreed. I wonder what those values are. Do you know?

Ours supposedly are founded on the Judeo-Christian traditions, later encapsulated in the Constitution along with whatever else the founders were influenced by when they wrote the Constitution.

Do you not find the idea of the state paying people to rat out their neighbors provocative?

"Do you not find the idea of the state paying people to rat out their neighbors provocative?"

I would if I didn't live under a state that, in different times, all them way after Moses and Christ and therefore fully benefited by their lessons, enforced slavery, enforced segragation, bombed Vietnamese and Laotian kids (for their own good, you see -- we had to kill them or maim them to save them), supported terrorists in Central America and Afghanistan and coerced its own citizens to denounce their friends and associates.

"I wonder what those values are"

I mentioned a few of them, ones that look like some of our own. You know, almost if the Chinese were human beings instead of Bogeymen.

I never said the Chinese were boogeymen. You are projecting. Humans are not born with a fully developed set of universal values. They learn values from their parents and the surrounding culture, and the culture reinforces those values throughout an individuals life.

An Iroquois would not necessarily have the same values as a Puritan, but both are fully human. In fact, an Iroquois would not have the same values as a Hopi - very different cultures.

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There are many different values that Chinese people can have, just like any ethnicity. There is Confucianism, Buddhism, Taoism, Christianity, Marxism, utilitarianism, liberalism, transhumanism, etc., and value systems that individuals derive from their own experience and moral reasoning.

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"Mine, good or bad, are derived from Irish Catholicism - love thy neighbor; do unto others; don't kill, steal, cheat, lie, or envy"

Unless your neighbor is a Protestant.

"China has laws but not the rule of law"

China has al least as much rule of law as any Catholic kingdom until the early 1900s.
Suffices to say, Louis XIV condemned in a proto-Stalinist trial Fouquet to a life sentence (originally banishment) for being prosperous.

"Unless your neighbor is a Protestant." A cousin who attended a Roman Catholic school was subjected to a sustained attempt to teach hatred of Protestants. This was in a British school funded largely by Protestant (and atheist) taxpayers.

The tale was consistent with unpleasant stories from other RC cousins, and indeed tales of his experience a couple of generations earlier from my Irish RC grandfather.

I am therefore impervious to sentimental tripe about Irish Roman Catholics.

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+1 - to Rayward, for what I was going to post. Given that the "hospitals" in Wuhan/ Hebai are being called "Deathatoriums" since they possibly could be spreading the disease (one so-called 'superspreader' patient recently infected 57 people in a hospital, and you can bet most if not all of them were taking precautions like wearing masks and washing hands), you have to be brave to risk your life for a mere $142 in renminbi/yuan.

Bonus trivia: learned a new word, "nosokomial" illness, the word simply meaning "hospital" (used as an adverb) in Greek. A hospital-induced illness. Check in healthy, check out at the basement morgue.

I've seen those open bed room pictures and keep wondering why no one bothers to invest in some cheap framing and a lot of plastic sheets (drop cloth or construction vapor barrier + duct tape) to provide some isolation of each patient.

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My grandparents' generation knew that going into a hospital generally meant you weren't walking out.

Hospitals are germ factories. Be very careful even if you only visit a sick friend/relative.

Always wash your hands. Keep fingers/hands away from your face, mouth, nose. Avoid hand rails, elevator buttons, door knobs as much as possible.

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"For each person with a fever who is reported by an official or citizen, there is a reward of 500 yuan ($71)"

Hmm it's only half as much, but the return - unlike reporting yourself - will scale. $71 to turn in hundreds if not thousands of potentially (not confirmed) sick people. Call now. People are standing by!

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But could have been even better with MyCFAVisit Survey time for my life.

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Liberty-destroying and not economically efficient. Those whose bodies are rapidly manufacturing coronavirus have a god-given talent, the fruits of which are theirs to sell at the free market price. I propose a market by which those who are infected auction their behavior. How much will you pay me to not clear my lungs upwind of the nearby elementary school?

After a certain point, about the price of well aimed bullet.

Isn't it intervening with the free market?

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Don't forget to later denounce all those school kids to authorities, to collect your due reward ;)

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I think they're running into one of the natural limits to the effectiveness of quarantines -- the fact that desperate people will do almost anything to escape them.

The situation in China sounds very bad right now. I don't have anything to say except that I wish them the best.

"them" --> "us". Or do you think it can't spread outside China, perhaps even to Zachville?

I don't follow. Are you saying you wouldn't wish them the best if it couldn't spread to Zachtopia?

Look at the news. Even healthy people are going through a very bad time.

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So if there are some noisy neighbors you don't like and you send someone over to infect them so you can report them a few days later, what kind of split with the contagion carrier is appropriate?

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"the epicenter of ...": oh God, must they?

At least they didn't write "skyrocket".

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Singapore's been paying $100 for each person under quarantine. There's an interesting policy twist: for salaried employees, the government pays the $100 to the employer instead of the quarantined employee, to compensate the company for the lost labor and dissuade it from terminating the employee.

If this gets going here and health law proves inadequate, the state could always sequester a really big jury.

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desperate to find ways to stop the spread of the infection

China is an independent nation possessing nuclear weapons, is desperate to find ways to stop the spread of the infection, and Wuhan is a Chinese city. Solve for the equilibrium.

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There's another theory in which a Chinese businessman claim about 50,000 people were dead and Government hiding the truth from the people to stabilize country. Source: https://www.ccn.com/billionaire-whistleblower-wuhan-coronavirus-death-toll-is-over-50000/
<a href="https://www.surveyeradar.com/"Surveyeradar

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There's another theory in which a Chinese businessman claim about 50,000 people were dead and Government hiding the truth from the people to stabilize country. Source: https://www.ccn.com/billionaire-whistleblower-wuhan-coronavirus-death-toll-is-over-50000/
<a href="https://www.surveyeradar.com/" Surveyeradar

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